Chris & Keith | Homepage Overview

Keith Berelowitz: Hey, Chris. How you doing?

Chris LaFay: I'm doing well. Have you had a good start to your week?

Keith Berelowitz: Had a bit of a bike accident. Ended up in hospital over the weekend. Broke a vertebra, staples in my head, but other than that. Right.

Chris LaFay: Wait, did you just casually say that you broke a vertebrae and you have staples in your head?

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, but it's fine.

Chris LaFay: It's fine. It's a. Now wait, were you riding like, like a pedal bike or are you riding like a motorbike?

Keith Berelowitz: It's a pedal bike. I mean, it's only going about 12 kilometers an hour. So that made it okay?

Chris LaFay: Yeah, yeah. Dear. And you're, you're here right now. Like, you're not.

Keith Berelowitz: No, no, no. You've got to keep moving forward, so.

Chris LaFay: Well, I'm glad that you're.

Keith Berelowitz: I can't do anything about it. It's just like, just a bit, it's pain in my back now and I, I'll be.

Chris LaFay: Oh, okay. When I hear like broken vertebrae, I think of like hospitalized for a long time.

Keith Berelowitz: Well, no, because it's a stable break. It means that they don't need to operate, but it means I can't do any exercise for like six weeks.

Chris LaFay: Oh, that's actually not that bad. Okay.

Keith Berelowitz: And then like. Well, I'm saying six weeks. My wife is staring me going, it's 12 weeks.

Chris LaFay: Try number two.

Keith Berelowitz: Well, no, it's the, the, the computer is now doing some weird update. Hang on a second.

Chris LaFay: You're good. Oh, now you're coming back in a second time.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I'm coming back in on my phone.

Chris LaFay: Oh, gotcha. Okay, there we go.

Keith Berelowitz: Because I don't hang down.

Chris LaFay: Hold on. There we go. I went ahead and muted you on your desktop.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, okay, perfect. Sorry about that. I don't know what is going on, but it's now doing some like weird update.

Chris LaFay: Technology has hated me over the last few months. Whenever I do screen shares in Google, meet in any zoom team, sometimes my computer crashes and I'm like, I have like a two year old computer. Like, it's fine. I spent good money on this. But you know.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, exactly. We, we only use Macs so that these things are stable. But it, like it says I'm, it's going to do an update tonight and, but tonight is not like now.

Chris LaFay: Tonight should be later tonight.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, exactly. So now it seems to have done whatever it wanted to do. Okay, so I'm very keen to see what you've come up with.

Chris LaFay: Yes. So give you. I'm going to. So I'm going to Give you a little bit of a walkthrough of what the next like five minutes is going to be here.

Keith Berelowitz: Right.

Chris LaFay: So I'm going to. I have a couple of notes I'm going to just tell you about now, just so you kind of have an idea of like this is kind of where some of my head's at on things. The first time I scroll, I'm going to scroll through the entire home page and I'm not going to say anything at all. I'm just going to let you look at it because that's, that's what everybody wants to. They just want to look at it. Yeah. I'm then going to scroll through a second time and actually walk you through kind of my decision making process on things. And I'll also point out during that second time things that I'm not as keen on as others as well too to like invite some collaboration into it. Once I get done with those two, the floor is then yours to ask questions, etc. Etc. Does that sound good?

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, sounds good to me. And I'm about to get the computer back up.

Chris LaFay: Oh, okay. I'll wait then until that.

Keith Berelowitz: Yes. Just. Yeah, so just give me a second to see what the hell is going on here. Where did see. So weird. I don't care about. Zoom. In a second. Okay, so I'm going to come off the other one.

Chris LaFay: Ah, here we go. Number three. Here we go.

Keith Berelowitz: Okay, that should be it.

Chris LaFay: Now we're good. Fantastic. All righty, let's roll. So couple of just overall notes, specific wording. I didn't focus too much in on there. I more think more along the layout. So yes, there are a lot of good words in here. This doesn't have to be a 100 words thing. This is we're primary primarily today looking at the aesthetic in the general flow of the homepage. The words can kind of follow after that. I'll talk to you a little bit about coloration and some decisions I made with coloration. Also, photos can all get swapped out. You gave me a number of good ones. I use some. We can easily swap out photos. Not too worried about those as well. I had a design for your your letter that I liked, but I didn't know how. I wanted to put the photo of Sylvester with that and you'll see that in a moment. I do want to add it in. I just couldn't figure out how I wanted to do it, so I wanted to invite some collaboration with that as well too to. So those are a couple of the like global notes as you're kind of seeing this for the first time. So let's go. I'm going to go ahead and scroll through this silently to start with. And of course, the video stopped playing right there again. So that right there is the homepage. So let me walk you through some of the thought processes here. First, from a coloration standpoint, I wanted to use the gradient as the call to action color. Just straight up, you see the gradient, you know that there's action attached to that. I made one caveat with the squiggly line dividers and I'll explain why. Yeah, we have our little condition here. Wanted to put these. I wanted to prove that there was stuff below the fold. So I'm not a. In general, I'm not a big fan of like banner sections taking up the full, like vertical real estate. I like kind of displaying on desktop especially. There's something else under here. And I wanted to really hone in on the. The questions that are going to be asked by the person. You know, are you medically ready? Are you actually like physically ready for or mentally ready for it as well, too? Showcasing the app, getting them in there. I think that's a fantastic piece. You had that already. Love it. One of the things that I wanted to try, so from a texture perspective, I like all the roundedness that we had, but I also wanted to ground it in something very sharp and grid like, because I feel like from a medical perspective, that's common, but I wanted it to be subtle. The other thing I wanted to try is I was thinking through, like, how do you visualize this idea of a person being extraordinarily confused and then they gain clarity. And one of the areas that I like to put texture into sites is the dividers between sections. And one of the thoughts that I had is rather than just doing common straight line dividers or things like that, or like little icons and stuff, what if we kind of went from chaos to something more smooth? And that's obviously a very subtle thing. I'm not saying that people are going to see that and be like, oh my gosh, that's my mental journey. That's not what I'm suggesting, but something that's a little bit more hand drawn in the midst of a lot of gridded, centralized stuff. I think breaks that up a little bit. And I broke my rule.

Keith Berelowitz: Weirdly, I've used that kind of thing in the past, so I love it.

Chris LaFay: Fantastic. And I, I drew out about five or six of these. And so there can be multiple use the colors can be swapped on them as well. I did just keep a very baseline informational section here. I'm not honed in on exactly. Like, I don't know exactly what I want these words to be, but I do like having a little bit of a break. This is where we talk about the different types of problems that people are going to be having. Like we mentioned in our call the other day. The other day, some more squiggles. I like the idea of showing the process, but from the. The design that y' all had doesn't really transform the web very well. And there was also too many steps. And I was like, what is, what is the root of this route? Part one is knowing that you have options. Part two is kind of together. It's like, are you medically ready? Are you emotionally ready? And then from there, then you reach out when you're ready. Which is why I use the gradient around the edges here. There's no CTA in here. Probably want to add the cta, but I wanted to simplify the process and I wanted to kind of showcase that with a little bit more of that hand drawnness as well, too. The letter, I think you can kind of see here, like, if I put the photo Sylvester, like at the top or in the middle or whatever, it would have made this letter really long. And I didn't like that. I tried putting them over here, not on paper. And that also just seemed very forced. So I, I paused on this mainly because I wanted to get your final letter whenever you were done with it. So I kind of see the length and the style of it and then possibly make some adjustments. This other piece I didn't actually show went ahead and designed a modal box that actually uses that gradient as kind of that background shadow. And in general, anything can be put inside these boxes, not just videos. And then our final call to action using the gradient, the multi CTA is there, and then a very simple footer at the bottom. So that is the why behind everything thoughts.

Keith Berelowitz: Okay, so I like it. I really do like it. The boxes, you know, the fine clinical tri. Like, you know, when I'm looking at it on screen, if you take it all the way to the top, so that we're just seeing, you know, if there's a word there, like, are you medically ready? I think we get. Forget the, the, the. The words themselves. You just need to see the whole word. That's the only thing that I would say, like, when I look at it, that, you know, the, the word ready in the second box is ah.

Chris LaFay: Okay, now it's so the one thing to think about. Everybody's screen size is going to be slightly different. So what the things to kind of, and this is, this is hard to visualize. I've been doing this for 20 years. I still haven't found the right words for it. You're looking for basically when you're thinking about content sizing, layout and whether or not things are visible or not,.

Keith Berelowitz: It's,.

Chris LaFay: It's not a 5050 thing. The, the goal of this header section, this, like this, we'll call this the banner section. With the header, the paragraph and the buttons. There is a default quantity of space that goes between the top of the browser and then the top of that head, that actual, that header tag that could be reduced a little bit, thus kind of, you know, generally pushing everything up some, which would get the success rate of what you're suggesting higher, but it's never going to be 100%.

Keith Berelowitz: No, no, yeah, okay, I, I, I get it. And then just in the, in those white boxes, those icons, It's the white against the black. I hadn't even thought about white against the black, but actually it, it does quite, it does work. Okay, I get that.

Chris LaFay: My thinking here with white on black is that I'm trying to use the solid colors to kind of draw attention to things. So like, this is obviously like one of the primary sections. Hey, find out who you are, basically. What, what problem do you want to solve? So I try to use color as a way to like draw your eye to different places. Now is that going to stand up over time when there's other people editing the site? It's not, but we can start at a good place at least.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, well, you, we start in a good place and then we, and then we just make sure people do the same thing. Okay. So I love that we may remove some of the copy, but that's besides the point. The Hub, I think, you know, that works. We would just change the image there or we can actually embed the Hub there and there. I mean, I don't know if, if you would. Because the Hub actually embeds on the page if we wanted to.

Chris LaFay: Do, we want to do that or not? Hon, that, so the, it's, it's app.trialport, right?

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. So, so the Hub is slightly smaller than this.

Chris LaFay: Okay. The embedded version of this.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, the embedded version of this. But again, I was quite keen to avoid it on the home page and we certainly will have it on the, the trial port Live network page is where we will Put the hub. Because I do want people to be able to go to our website and see what's going to be embedded. Yeah. But I do understand what it really means. Okay, fine. I like that, really like the squiggles. The images are those, those are rounded corners.

Chris LaFay: Yes, they are. All the, all the, there's two rounded edges in the whole system. There's one that is this size and then the rest are pill shaped. So they're completely fully rounded. Those are the only two types of roundedness you'll see. And I think the only places that the pill shape is used are the buttons and the navigation bar. Everything else I'm pretty sure is the, the tight roundedness.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. But I, I like the accentuation. The, the bit that I think isn't working is the blue against the black. Okay. I, I don't know. You, you tell me why did you go with. Let's go with that.

Chris LaFay: Mainly because this is the place where we're going to try to focus people's like problems into. It's like, hey, these are the four different types of problems you might be thinking about. This is where people are going to emotionally connect. So I wanted to draw more attention to it. Now I do agree that amongst all the darkness it is very bright. I think that I could be swung either way. Now. There are things that I will, there are hills that I will die on and hills that I won't die on. Yeah, this is not a hill that I would die on. Saying that this has to be blue. It is a lot. But also I felt like these like subtle gradients here didn't really fit for this either.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I, I agree. It needs to stand out.

Chris LaFay: I, the one other thing, the one other piece I didn't like about this as much and there I didn't really find a good combination. So basically we have about five, I think we have five total colors. We have pink, purple, blue, the canvas dark color and then the light text color. And then we have this like darker off color which is, which is what's behind here. When you do a light blue section, you can't make this pink because light blue with pink on top, that's bad. Purple is also bright as well too, so that doesn't work here. So this was the best kind of like background color to fit this text on. But it also, I, I, I, I, I, I feel the tension that you're feeling and I don't know the right answer for it, it, right now.

Keith Berelowitz: Look, it, it may be because I just had never thought about it. It doesn't mean it's wrong. It's just. I never thought about it. Okay. And then. And then when. When you. When you touch over the. Each of the boxes. Yeah. There's a little bit of movement in there, right?

Chris LaFay: Yep. This is the kind of movement that I. Oh, yeah. Now, if I didn't hover over the buttons. They do a little bit of a. They do a little bit of a. That's the type of motion I like to do. It's interactive motion to where you know that what you're doing, something is happening. That's. That's what I like.

Keith Berelowitz: Rather than just noise for the sake of it. Okay. I love this section. I absolutely love. Because it's bang, bang, bang, bang, bang.

Chris LaFay: This is the section that took all of my creative. And I know it's very simple. Don't get me wrong. I know that. But all of this other stuff up here was relatively easy. This is the part that basically, when I got it, took me out the rest of the week and I was like, I. I've used all my juices. And then last Friday when I texted you, I was drawing squiggly lines for about two hours.

Keith Berelowitz: So Aaron just. I just. My wife's got a good eye for this stuff, so can you just come here quickly? She's coming. One second. I love that because then it's clear. You know, we clearly are a technology company, but there is a clear path to all of this. Karen, meet Chris. Hello, Chris. Hi. Okay, so if we just scroll to the top.

Chris LaFay: You want to go to the very top?

Keith Berelowitz: Just to the very top. We'll just take it down very quickly. Starts with. With a simple video, woman catching her breath, and we're going into the place. Then it's, you know, find clinical trials. Are you medically. Medically fit? Are you Medifit? Are you ready fit? We'll come up with that. No pressure, you know, find the trial. That's the hub. The squiggly lines represents, basically. Oh, do you like that as well? Yeah, yeah. The squiggly lines really is representing people's like, chaos. And then we. We're bringing the calm down, pulling out certain words like clear, confident. Then the blue is the. The one thing that I'm. I wasn't sure about, but actually, it's now starting to grow on me. I think if we choose the right images, it will work. Yeah, that's the thing. I think it's the images that are going to make that work.

Chris LaFay: Like, this was like, that's a bad image right there.

Keith Berelowitz: So.

Chris LaFay: Which I totally get. No, and we might actually. We might actually replace these. Rather than having these be overlays. I was actually just thinking about this a little bit more. Rather than having these be overlays and forcing a very tall vertical photo, we might actually separate them. They'll be connected, but have a square photo here and then a square section down here below. And treat them like two separates rather than one long with an overlay on top of it. Anyway, I digress.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. And then we get to. So. And like that calmness. And then this is the path from interest to confident next step. So it's going. Because you're a logical person. This is what you do. One, two, three. Yeah. Then connect. Yeah. And the squiggles are becoming less chaotic. And then there'll be a letter from me like that as to. Hi, everyone and thank you. Yeah. I really like it. Can I. Am I allowed to be really honest? Yeah. My only thing is when you first show me the first squiggly line, it looks to me like. Like a heart rate monitor in a hospital.

Chris LaFay: I thought about that. Which is why over here, this one got a little bit angled up some. I was like, maybe that looks a little bit too, like too sharp like.

Keith Berelowitz: When you read it to me. And then it gets progressively more squiggly. It's brilliant. But if you don't know that, you would just go.

Chris LaFay: But that's like.

Keith Berelowitz: But I actually like the fact if you look. It's like quite. It. It's quite intense at the top. Then it's starting to calm down and then you get to.

Chris LaFay: Yeah.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: I can. I can draw a handful more of them. There's. I probably have about six. Maybe I can. I can doodle a handful more of them as well too. And then there will be some that are just this as well. Whenever I design things, I always like to bring hand. Something hand drawn into the mix because that's what makes things feel real.

Keith Berelowitz: Cookie cutter. Can I just ask you with the squiggly lines, what I actually quite like about them? Is there a way that. And just say, Keith, no, this is a stupid idea that you've actually. That it's animated or you know how you've animated the. The pills so you. So that it's like. So the. The colors changing as you go through the line or is that so.

Chris LaFay: I was actually thinking about that. I believe the way that that was coded. We can actually have the. We actually do something similar to this.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: But have it just be very slow. The downside with it, though. One thing that I do like about the way that it is now without animation is the busy side is. We'll call it red, and the calm side is blue. And I think that that mashup of blue being calm and red, pink being hectic, I kind of like that. But so my initial read would be to keep the. Keep it stationary.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So that the blue is always over here. Yeah, that's my opinion. I. I'm not gonna die again. Going back to, like, the hill. I wouldn't die on that hill, but I definitely am, like, leaning 75, not animating the color behind the line.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I love it. I think it's really good. I really love this section.

Chris LaFay: Fantastic. The other thing I actually just thought about is I'm probably gonna take step one and step four and make them about the same width as step two and three so that they're not. As long as it'll make it feel a little more full. I'll make that adjustment, but. Fantastic. Anything else?

Keith Berelowitz: No, that's it. I mean, lovely. What will be helpful, because what we will now do is embed or we will look at the copy we have, because we're currently writing copy for all the pages we've got for each of the various groups. Those pages are done. But now this gives us the opportunity to look at this and go, okay, is the copy all right, or what is it we need to change? Essentially, like, my rule of thumb is I go onto a website page. If within two minutes, I don't know what these people are doing, I'm off. Quickly. Lines actually are printed.

Chris LaFay: So what? Let me go ahead and pull something up here. Oh, no, you actually. You sent me the folder. Sorry. I was trying to go into my own. Like, my own section, trying to find the trial port folder, but you actually sent me stuff. Let me go and find that link. New website. I think this is the. Nope, that's not the newest one.

Keith Berelowitz: And I did try and clean it up, so it's just easier for you.

Chris LaFay: And not chaotic, which was lovely, by the way. Okay, let me actually. Let me pull. Where would it be? What's the URL for that? It's new. I know. I think so. I think this is living in one of the other folders. I'm looking at the updated one that you sent over that has a lot of, like, the imagery.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. So it's sitting. Are you talking about the copy?

Chris LaFay: Yes.

Keith Berelowitz: Okay. So the copy is sitting in. Is it that one? Let me just go into. Just to check.

Chris LaFay: Yeah.

Keith Berelowitz: I mean, it's A bit messy because we're all in there at the moment, clean, going through it. But I'll put this into the chat so that you can, you can see the link and you should have access anyway. Just, just click on the link and see that you got the access.

Chris LaFay: Let's see, there's, there's that. Okay, wonderful.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. So the homepage Medifit page. So we have, we don't have the copy there, but you know, the, we've been working on the biopharm and CRO draft text. All of these pages are being worked on. It's the copy at the top of the document that is our latest version. The way that we've been doing it is we've been keeping everything all within one document. But just making. To make sure that we've got everything. But it's the copy at the top that, that, that is the, the latest.

Chris LaFay: Okay, so let me pull. Whoops. Let me pull up my, my site map here.

Keith Berelowitz: Preview.

Chris LaFay: Come on, Internet. You got this. There we go. Okay, trial port here is site map. So this right here was the general sitemap that we talked about on our call last time. I have not done a one to one of. Of this some for this site map over here to the content that you have in the Google Drive that you just sent over.

Keith Berelowitz: But it is pretty much on there. The only thing that may come out is pricing commercial where we don't do that. Okay, but the rest, the, the rest of it does look right. We've got how it works. Medifit ready Fit Live network. Yeah, it's just the pricing commercial, but we'll worry about that down the line. Perfect.

Chris LaFay: About us. So I don't see an about us page in the.

Keith Berelowitz: So they're still working on the about us page. Okay, so they are halfway through, but right now they're going to work on the About Us, the how it works, the Medifit ready for page, which we kind of did where you had Kada with the muscle and they need to work on the TrialPort Live network page. The blog page is what it is. FAQs will come from me, but we're still working on that. But yeah, I think, I think your site is pretty much on so.

Chris LaFay: And I want to say I think, I think we brought in the blog post as well, not the actual blog page. I want to see if we did this or not. The URL would be the same if we did it. Nope, we didn't. Okay, never mind. Ignore that. So, all right, so question for you in terms of Content. So right now you're writing up a lot of stuff within Google Drive.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Or Google Docs.

Keith Berelowitz: Tell us how you want it because I'm happy to put it into whatever format you want so you know which.

Chris LaFay: Block goes where so we can do. So are you guys handwriting all the content? Are you guys using AI for the content? What are you guys doing?

Keith Berelowitz: Handwriting every word, handwriting everything.

Chris LaFay: Okay, awesome. This is what I'm going to do is I'm going to send you a. Nope, it's not that. Where is it? That's not it either. Where to go? This is new for me. So in general, website content has about eight different types of sections in terms of. When you're thinking about like headline text, paragraphs and how they line up. Right. You have a banner section, obviously, which all banner sections have a title and a description and probably a button. You have kind of your classic image with content image on one side, content on the other. Multi column layout, sometimes with images, sometimes with icons. Rinse and repeat. Right. If you were to think of each and each of these inside of Google Docs, if you were to think of these in one of these seven, eight building blocks.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Importing content would be so much easier. So like, rather than saying like. So like for the Howard, where I'm on the Biopharma and Sierra's draft text page, the top section, this is very much obvious. Very obvious. Actually, let me just pull this up rather than try to explain it.

Keith Berelowitz: So top six. That's the hero.

Chris LaFay: Yeah, that's the hero. So obviously this is like your, this is your, this is your page title. Logically, inside of a banner section, you need a title description and a button. So this is going to be your title, that's going to be your description, these are going to be your buttons. That's all logical, right? But when you start getting into these other sections, that's where you can kind of see things in a lot of different ways. So if while you are writing content, you were thinking, is this a call to action strip? Is this an image on one side, text on the other? Should this be a multi column layout? If you had that above each of these.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, that's what I'm asking Guy to do. So if you can send me that, that you just showed me that he can think. Exactly. This is a cta, this is a, this is a, an image strip, whatever it happens to be.

Chris LaFay: Yep, perfect. And that'll get us because you actually, you're gonna have more than seven or eight building blocks at your disposal. But just doing Those and kind of those basic layouts will get us 75% there on the first pass.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And then we can spend our time actually doing the more creative stuff rather than the trying to draw assumptions at that point. So I will send you a guide that says here's the block type and then here's kind of the general layout of that block as you're thinking about it. That should then guide your, your folks the whole way through.

Keith Berelowitz: Got a call with them 9am tomorrow in the UK.

Chris LaFay: So I can go ahead and I can go ahead and use the rest of our time. We had an hour schedule. I use the rest of the time to put that together and send over your way so that you have it.

Keith Berelowitz: So it was just one thing I wanted to throw into the mix. So what we. What I'm thinking of doing, this is not for definite but what I'm thinking of doing is introducing a character. This character. It's probably going to be easiest if I just show it to you and then I'll explain.

Chris LaFay: Let me share my. Let me stop sharing.

Keith Berelowitz: Can you see the comedian on screen?

Chris LaFay: I can, yes. Most clinical trials are explained as if eligibility is the finish line. It is not being medically eligible for a trial.

Keith Berelowitz: I'm not going to go in. Basically we're talking about 45 second videos that are going to go on specific pages. Clearly the quality of the video needs to be improved. This was me rough drafting it so they saw what I wanted to do. But essentially you've got the copy on the page a lot of people don't necessarily read anymore. And you know there are certain pages that that I think need some explanation and one of those pages is. So this will only be on particular pages like Medifit where the homepage introducing who cam is and then it will be on the Medi Ready Fit page Tripod Live Network how it works. You know a few pages where we will have this little video that's there for people who can then take the 30, 45 seconds rather than reading all the text. It's there and it explains everything to them. It allows us to use this in other places as well. But it then sits on. It also sits on the website or if you think that's a horrific idea, tell me now. We stop it now.

Chris LaFay: So first off, I know you mentioned like the. The video needs some quality improvements. Wholeheartedly agree. It feels very AI because obviously it is two unless you have a talking.

Keith Berelowitz: Comedian that you can live. Man.

Chris LaFay: Hey. Hey Daisy. You want to be. You want to be a talking Dog. We can put a chameleon costume on you. My dog said. My dog looked at me like I was an idiot, as she normally does because I am not my wife and my wife is my dog's best friend. Such is Life two. This is the thing, the, the element that concerns this is not web related at all. This is more brand related is depending on how it's done.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: You're taking a very human, human to human interaction.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And you're putting a placeholder caricature with that. So you have really good imagery of real people doing real things and dealing with real problems. And now the chameleon is the spokesperson. I don't know if that's going to hit from a messaging standpoint now.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: I am not the master and commander of your brand and your messaging. That I don't know. But my, my initial gut reaction is it might feel a little fake whether you nail the video style or not. But that's not my lane of expertise. I don't, don't hold super hard onto that.

Keith Berelowitz: No, no, I'm not. But it's good to hear it as well. And I, and I, I do want that authenticity and I don't want to be like the old Microsoft paperclip that was just annoying and was always there.

Chris LaFay: Oh, that. Okay. So that. Okay, that's what. Yeah. So I, Let me, let me, let me, let me tell you a little story. So classics. My, my. And I'm gonna, I'm gonna pull an example from my own experience. And again, the world that you're living in and that I live in, vastly different. My logo is that lightning bolt. That means absolutely nothing to me at all. It's just what I designed one day and it stuck. And that's just what it is. All that being said is about three or four months ago, I mean, you saw my website. It's very video game esque and things like that. And so one of the things that I wanted to do about three months ago was to create a caricature that could at some point overtake the stupid lightning bolt as my logo and become the thing, the face, if you will. So I worked with a designer artist that designed, you know, a couple of different things. Something that was more human, something that was a little bit more animal esque, something that was like Zelda and Link the adventurer sort of thing. And all of them fell flat. And I was talking to somebody about, I was like, why do these all feel bad to me? Because I love video games. I love this stuff. Like this should exude My personality. And they're like, when you take just that, that character and you set it on a pedestal, not within the world that you've built, but just by itself. And that icon is the first thing that people see. What do you think? And I was like, oh, it looks like it looks childish. And he's like, bingo. That's the problem. Now I'm not saying that your chameleon is childish, but when you put the weight of your company's brand onto an animal, an artsy animal, can that animal hold the weight of the message that you're portraying? And the message that I'm portraying is I build websites.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So again, take that, take that experience, share. Not as something that is coming from a deep rooted sense of like knowing in depth trial port in your customers. Because I don't, that's just my little smidge of experience from my little smidge of reality that I live in.

Keith Berelowitz: So that's, that's really helpful. I mean, you know, the reason we're using this chameleon in some of our initial efforts for Ready Fit, because we, it's talking about, you know, that chameleon blends to whichever group of those four groups and people, people have got that straight away. So I thought, look, I mean, again, not all of my ideas are going to be good. Some of them will be effing awful. This could be one of them. But you know, the geckos work quite well for Geico 100.

Chris LaFay: You're not wrong.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, the, the, the nodding dog has worked well for a brand here called Churchill in the uk. And we're talking about a, a thing that is very cut and dry. Yes. We're adding that humanity in this, adds. This takes just a bit of the sting out of the tail and otherwise I'm, I'm too worried. We're too, we're too much like everyone else. But anyway, that's for me to think about. But essentially all I'm saying to you is there may, there may be spots on various pages where we would then just want that video space.

Chris LaFay: But I'm assuming that's not so from a web perspective. So going away from the brand and more to the web perspective is. I am a huge proponent of having explanatory videos across the site. My website has a ton of them. With video, you don't want to make the assumption when you're thinking about page content, you do not want to make the assumption that somebody will watch the video. So any of the content that's in the video does also need to be on the site as well there. It's not a replacement mechanism. And so unless it's non essential. So like obviously like you know, the Wednesday video, you're not going to have all of that content like that. That's a, that's a different thing. Thing. The other element in terms of going back to. We'll just call it characters in general.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Rather than treating the character as a spokesper, literal spokesperson, think of the character like a texture. So rather than having it be the one that's doing the talking, what if. And this isn't, this isn't the right, this isn't the right idea, but let's pretend that the aesthetic of your website was more like a forest. I can, I can, I can picture an example of a metaphor easily. More easily with a forest and a chameleon. Let's say you had a very forest texture. You had grass and you have palm tree, you have trees and all this other stuff. The dividers within that aesthetic might be like a row of ground or like a row of rock with a chameleon inside of it. Kind of, you know, tapestry in with it, mimicking. So it shows up in different places. Logical. That makes it feel like it's a part of that aesthetic, but it doesn't feel like it's taking the voice away from your authority. And again, that's a terrible example.

Keith Berelowitz: But I get what you say. I mean, we're going to do some testing like you did. We're going to do some testing and if it crashes horribly with patient groups and biotech and pharma, it's gone. But I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't going to be an issue having video embedded. Because if it's not the gecko, sorry, if it's not the chameleon, it's one of us. And that, I mean that's the other option. It's then going to be one of the team explaining something. Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And I would keep that if you decide to go option B. And again, this is also my smaller business mindset speaking is that I'm a big fan of consistency when it comes to spokesperson. Now the, the thought process that I would have to expand upon, that might be something along the lines of, excuse me, if you had your. You could divide that roll up by buckets. So you might be the storyteller for anything that's kind of like large company oriented. And then you might have a different spokesperson for like. Let's talk about how we decide if you're medically ready and how if we Decide you're physically ready. How our application works in the, the. How you could divide it up like that. Because I do think that there is a nice thing about consistency.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And so there's also a reason that some of those videos might be best shot from your webcam on your laptop. There's also a reason where some of them going a little bit more professional might also make sense. That's a dividing line that you don't need to decide. That does not need to be something that holds you up.

Keith Berelowitz: And any professional shots will be done in September anyway because we're. We've got another event going on. So we will use time then to get those professional videos shot as well.

Chris LaFay: Fantastic.

Keith Berelowitz: Which, which again, I think we will do irrespective of whether we go with the chameleon or not. I, I want to test the chameleon because I've done quirky stuff like this in the past and it's gone down extremely well. And for rare disease, the zebra is the animal of rare.

Chris LaFay: Interesting.

Keith Berelowitz: And so, you know, and, and it's just, it's. You see a zebra in, in relation to anything and you know, it's rare. That, that's the, that's the messaging there. And there's a lot we can do with this chameleon on World Rare Disease Day, etc. All the various things it can also be used. You know, I'm thinking about all of our clients and you know, it makes a mark to say we're working on this study because that comedians then blending into their logo or into their colors or whatever it happens to be. So I'm trying to think beyond that, but I take your point. It can go horribly wrong. I have to say I love your website and if I could have Super Mario as my website, I would do that instantly. Like I looked at it. I just. Charlie said, I think we should look at. I said, yes, we're using it.

Chris LaFay: Yes, yes.

Keith Berelowitz: Because I got it straight away because it was relatable. That was the big thing, is that you took something that is part of modern culture, extremely relatable by anyone, by anyone and everyone. And that's what it was. And that is why this character of sorts is something that I want to. I, I would like to do. I've seen it done off really badly and that's why I'm nervous about it. That's why we're going to do some testing. But. And it may not be, I mean the original idea was a, a gerbil or a guinea pig, but that has that connotations in it.

Chris LaFay: Let me show you. I'm a very visual person in general. Let me, let me juxtaposition a couple of, a couple of things for you when you're thinking about. Really, you know what I love Max Max are really fantastic. Except that they still haven't figured out how to sync your contacts book from one device to another.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, it's,.

Chris LaFay: I don't understand. Okay, let me, let me pull this up here. So let me pull, let me do a screen share and I realize what you're going for is not this at all, but I am going to use mine. So like when you look here, one of the things that I honed in on was consistency. So like my logo's border is very consistent with the border of the boxes. It's very consistent with the border down here. I actually modified our oranges and our other colors to kind of match up with this library of assets that, that I now have, etc. Etc. So with that being said, I wanted a little dude that kind of stood on the ground down here on the bottom left so that as you went page to page, he can move around and do stuff and all that jazz. All that being said. So kind of keep that general like aesthetic in your mind. I had my designer friend, so I can't pull it up in my freaking computer. I'm going to do an old school like one of these. It's cute, right? It's freaking adorable. But if you, if the only thing you saw, like let's say that you went to my LinkedIn profile.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And you scroll down and you, and onwards had classic city consulting in my experience. And you saw that now obviously it would be vectorized and computerized, not hand drawn. But it looks like a childlike character.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And so I, I, I dithered on it for a long time and she made a couple of adjustments and this, that and the other and blah blah, blah. And so I was like, what if we went more humanoid? And so I sent her photos of like different team members and folks that I've worked with in the past and she came up with that, which is so much better now. These people, the, the learning that I got from this was I have a world that I have created, very video game oriented world. And one of the people that I know that's really good at storytelling was like, do you want there to be a single icon that every, that the whole story centers around one character or do you want the world to be recognizable and actually have multiple characters? So if somebody saw a Character, they would be like, oh, that's classic city consulting. I was like, oh, the latter. So I sent her all these different photos of different people that I know and said, use these as a baseline. So now that's actually the goal going forward, is now the world is created and multiple characters can be dropped in, myself included. But I don't have to be the face of it. And none of those have to be the logo. They are just the people that live inside the world. So again, that's probably not going to relate one to one, but it's a. Again, another story to just kind of put in the back of your head.

Keith Berelowitz: So it could actually be our voices overlaying the characters. Like,.

Chris LaFay: The thing is, I don't know how playful you want to go. I can get away with being extraordinarily playful because there's a million web developers and designers out there. My whole thing was exactly your. Your story was like the creme de la creme of what I wanted to hear. I saw the website, I got nostalgic. I know I wanted to work with them. Done. That's my point. Because every other website company looks all the same. So that's a big win for Chris.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: But I don't. I don't know if you have the chance to go as playful as that with the type of things that you're. You would have to lean, really. You have to either go all in or not. There is no. How. How familiar are you with the Savannah Bananas?

Keith Berelowitz: Yes. Very.

Chris LaFay: Okay, so they're all in. So imagine the yellow tux guy, the guy that owns it, Jesse Cole, Imagine if he wore the yellow tux, but literally just sat in the sands. Like he wore the get up.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: But he just sat there, did nothing. People would be like, it's like poking a. Yeah. Analytically. Like, hey, go do like we.

Keith Berelowitz: I mean, if that's the thing, if we go with the comedian, we're going all in. In every. In everything. It would become the trademark of us. I've just got to see whether fits. You know, the. There's a big thing in our industry about real people on a website. So where the. I've got two. Two issues. One, I get someone to shoot a video and then I find out that, I don't know, they've been arrested for drugs or something like that. Two, it's an ex member of staff. And. And I don't want to see X members of staff. Three, I want something that is gonna. That. That is not gonna age the website very quickly. I look at My old company and the website, even though it's only two years old, is very age because I'm still on it and I'm not. I haven't been there for two years.

Chris LaFay: Yeah, gotcha. I would say you want to go something like the Evernote style one. Yeah, Like, I think that.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I like that they've had this.

Chris LaFay: Side profile of the elephant in multiple iterations over the years. Actually, when I pulled it up, I actually didn't. I was. I was actually crossing my fingers and me, like, I hope they still have this. That elephant side view has been the same for, like, 20 years. But, like, what goes around it and the font and the exact design of the elephant has morphed very subtly.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Every two or three years. And this is what it is now. And so the elephant is there, is their mark. But. And I've actually not pulled their website up in a long time, so we're gonna see if my. My story continues to actually be correct. But I don't think they use their elephant anywhere other than their logo, which you could. You could fight both sides of that, of being, like, they're not, you know, an elephant company. Okay, that's cool. But also, how could you take elements of an elephant and apply them and so, like, thinking of, like, the hoof shapes and the trunk curves and that type of stuff, that kind of tie in that elephantness without it being, like, elephant stamped all over the place. So. Yeah, so they don't. So my story stands.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah. They've done nothing. But you. You see, what. What's good about the comedian is a couple of things. A, the color change, which is the obvious thing, but, you know, for me, it's. The eyes are everywhere. And that's what this is about is be. Anyway. I mean, I. I will. But I take your point. I. I will go back to them. The. The team tomorrow. We're going to flesh this out. We'll do some proper testing, see if it works. And if it works, then we'll introduce it. If it doesn't, we'll look again. I just want. I want. Video explainers are really important to me so that I'm not having to do this myself all the time. And it's. And it's done consistently. And I think that's what's missing from so many websites are good video explainers.

Chris LaFay: I would make the chameleon your icon mark.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: And I would do human explainers and then find ways to then use that icon mark across the site over time. Like, and if. And I know the Goal is to get the site up sooner rather than later. So there might need to be a small phase to, at the back end of that to apply some of the, you know, the chameleon stylization and stuff to different things, but it wouldn't be major at the end of the day. So I, I would recommend going the Evernote route and have humans lead the discussion points.

Keith Berelowitz: I'm just making some notes here. Human needs discussion points.

Chris LaFay: I would actually say. Let me show you. Consumem.com let's see if I can find one of their videos that they did that visually showcase what I'm talking about. Obviously you won't be able to use this company because they're here and they're here in Georgia with me. But they, They need a new website. Oh wait, they do need a new website and they're getting one because we built them one. Freaking heck. Let me pull up their. There's. There's technical terms for what I, what I'm trying to explain to you, but I don't know them because I'm not in the video world very much. And I think once I show you a photo or a video of this, I think you'll be like, oh yeah, I know exactly what that is. Here we go. This is great. So let me share my screen. So in terms of the, the Talking Heads where you're like doing explainers, what I think would look really great with your aesthetic is something like this. So are you familiar now? Take, take the, take the chill nature out of this. This is a fun company. But you know, like those video studios that have like the curvy white wall that you can put whatever colors you want onto the background. I think what would work out really well is doing your explainer videos in a place like that. And can you see the texture behind them too? There's like little white dots bouncing around. So not just a color wash wall, but I would do almost like a very zoomed out view where you could even like see the per. Like you can actually kind of see their chairs a little bit here. I'd almost set it up like podcast style to where you have. You're sitting on this like big white wall wall with your purple and blue colors shining behind you to color it with some textured lights and dots around the edges. And then like you being able to actually see like the person like walking you through almost like a full, like them sitting in their chair. I feel like that would be a very.

Keith Berelowitz: I like that because it, it keeps the human.

Chris LaFay: Well, something like chick fil A's red couch.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Obviously with like color in the background and stuff like that, but. And not this zoomed out, mind you. So I'm not a video. I'm talking a lot about areas that I'm not an expert in. I'm just a general creative person. And so that's. I know that shooting those videos in that type of location will take time, it'll take money, etc. Etc. Etc. But I would suggest chameleon icon for the logo. Have an embed the colors inside of it, and then do white wall videos with a chair and a single person talking straight to camera to explain things with a gradiented color wash behind you. And have those be the explainer videos. And then have them, however they're framed up, that they can be cropped to a square, they can be cropped to vertical or they can be cropped or horizontal because it's just one person in a chair talking to a camera.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So.

Keith Berelowitz: Right, brilliant. Okay. So Chris, are you going to send me this web this page now so I can mull over it any feed? That's fantastic.

Chris LaFay: Yep, absolutely. So the next steps here are. I'm gonna send you the link. It is password protected, so it's gonna pop up a box. Sometimes you have to insert that username password twice. There's like a little redirection that happens behind the scenes sometimes. Also what you're gonna see on it as well.

Keith Berelowitz: I don't have the password yet, do I?

Chris LaFay: No, I'll. I'll, I'll send all that. I'll send all that over to you. The other thing that you will see on it is this. And please, dear God, ignore the freaking AI video. I am not a fan, but it's not my choice. You'll see a little red button over here. It says report issue.

Keith Berelowitz: Yep.

Chris LaFay: Click the red button. It's going to take a screenshot. You can highlight with the box, stuff you want change, and then you can type in what you want changed here. Keep. If you do submit feedback like this, be hyper specifically person as well. And so. And I would. And so say it again.

Keith Berelowitz: It'll only be from me. Like I'm gonna have everyone on the call together and it will be one set of feedback coming through.

Chris LaFay: Fantastic. And this is how we're going to do content for the inside pages as well too. So there's that. I'll send that over to you. You'll have that. We don't get notifications when these tickets get submitted, so when you're done, shoot an email that says, hey, we're done.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So.

Keith Berelowitz: And do you want the copy changes in there as well or not really?

Chris LaFay: Yes. And actually this is actually the easiest way to do it because then we'll know like if you were, if this, if you wanted this changed, I would do something like header goes to boom and then paragraph goes to whatever. So, and the reason for this is because AI can handle a lot of this for us so that we can spend our time doing creat creative stuff and not copy and paste work. So the more specific you are, the more accurate it'll be in the long run and the more time we can spend designing cool things.

Keith Berelowitz: So perfect. Okay, send that all to me and I'll, and we'll get on with it and I'll get that back to you. I've told the team I want to see them probably Wednesday to go through it. So by Thursday, hopefully it's all done. I'm not envisaging a ton of stuff. There may be some, well, there'll be copy change, but that's it, I think predominantly.

Chris LaFay: So let's actually get our next meeting on the calendar. So I'm going to send you, and my thing that I send you over today will be like a guide with those seven or eight core building block structures so that as you're writing content, you're writing to those structures. I send that over to you today.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: When will you have all of your Google Docs ready by?

Keith Berelowitz: I can tell you that tomorrow. I will tell you, I think the, the plan was by the end of this week the pages that are currently being worked on, which I think is seven of them, will be done. If not, I mean, and that is the bulk of it, to be honest, because the blogs page, the FAQ page, those will come, but I, I, I just need to write those. So I would expect most of the copy is done by the end of.

Chris LaFay: This week, so in general by the end of the following week. So the end of, so Friday the 24th, you feel confident that new content and updated content will be good to go?

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I mean the, the blogs themselves, I'm assuming you don't need, don't need anything there?

Chris LaFay: No, we're just going to migrate them in. Easy peasy.

Keith Berelowitz: Fine. Okay. Well, I, yeah, I'm, I'm actually, I'm pulling all of the blogs that I want to put in there, so I'll have them in a separate folder. Or do you want to just migrate them directly from the page?

Chris LaFay: I can literally, I have a system that will literally Go and take all of your blog posts and move them all straight in, all their URLs, their names, their images, the whole kit and caboodle.

Keith Berelowitz: Okay. And then, and then the search function on that. How does that work?

Chris LaFay: WordPress search is very, very basic. Search is either it's going to sound odd, it's either stupid basic or it's stupid complex. And most small businesses don't need stupid complex because it costs a lot of money. So it's, it'll be just a simple type in a word, get the posts and pages that have that word contained inside of it.

Keith Berelowitz: That's it.

Chris LaFay: Nobody. Most small business websites, people don't use the search. That's just. It's used a lot on larger company sites where you have.

Keith Berelowitz: All right, sorry, Chris. Okay. Yeah. So. Okay. So, yeah, it's okay. So we just keep it as basic. I'm gonna. But what I say to you is some of my blog posts I don't like anymore. So I've actually curated all of these blogs separately.

Chris LaFay: Just give me the list of the URLs of the ones you want to keep.

Keith Berelowitz: Gotcha. Fine. And then it'll be easy instructions as to how to add new ones. Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Oh, yeah, it's. Yeah, 100%. You'll get all the training videos and stuff like that too. Once you, once you learn about three or four things within WordPress, you then realize, oh, once I know these three or four things, you can kind of extrapolate the rest of them. Not to oversimplify it, there is a learning curve. Websites aren't the easiest thing in the world to use. That's why people have a lot of feelings about them. But there's about four or five core pieces that if you understand them within the way that we build WordPress sites, you will understand the vast majority of your website.

Keith Berelowitz: Okay, so when do you want all copy or final copy? You tell me.

Chris LaFay: And that's.

Keith Berelowitz: That's what we'll do. Have it done by.

Chris LaFay: So I'm out of town most of next week.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So there's no reason for you to rush through this right now.

Keith Berelowitz: So if you say by the, by the 31st of July, if you can.

Chris LaFay: Have it by the 31st of July, that would be. That would be great. I will probably need about two weeks to get it all moved in.

Keith Berelowitz: Y.

Chris LaFay: So that'll be the. By August 14th. At that point.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So. And then, and then the following week is when I'm actually out in Minneapolis for the week. That was.

Keith Berelowitz: That's fine. I'm in. I'm in. Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So we could meet on Monday, August 24, with what will probably be a fairly full slate of content on your website.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, I mean, the only thing I'm hoping to do is have this all live by the 7th of September.

Chris LaFay: So I have. Okay, so I, I have a request then. So if that's the case, could you have your content done by Friday? Friday, July 24, next Friday. So basically two weeks.

Keith Berelowitz: No, it's fine. I, I will speak to them tomorrow and I'll say to him, it, it, it has to be final, final copy by this, by the 24th. Not a problem.

Chris LaFay: Okay, then that will, then we can then meet. Oh, I need to turn off that person's calendar. Hold on. That's why it's like, I'm not, I'm busy. I'm not that busy. Let's plan to meet the week of August 10th.

Keith Berelowitz: Fine. Perfect. That gives us time to go through the copy, make sure everything's fine and.

Chris LaFay: You can go through the copy and put all your little like edits through that tool while I'm gone. Yeah, which would be fantastic.

Keith Berelowitz: So I will have that because I'm actually then going away on the 22nd. So I'll have everything done by the, by the 21st. It doesn't matter because even on holiday. That's fine. I, I'm. There's only so long you can stare at a pool. So I will.

Chris LaFay: How does August 12th look to you for a. I'm basically all that. The August 12 thing is going to be is you'll have, you'll have already sent in all your content, I'll have got it all imported and we'll basically just do a click through the site to see any like, glaring bad errors.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, fine.

Chris LaFay: Does, does 1pm does our normal like 1pm Eastern time, which would be 6pm Your time?

Keith Berelowitz: Yes, I think that is August 12th is a Wednesday there. That's fine.

Chris LaFay: Yep.

Keith Berelowitz: Sweet.

Chris LaFay: Great. So Chris and Keith website.

Keith Berelowitz: Over. There.

Chris LaFay: Perfect.

Keith Berelowitz: Yep.

Chris LaFay: That is now in your calendar. And I, man, I, I mistyped your name because I don't know what I'm doing. Keith, It's a common name. It's not even a weird name. Sorry about that. And so, okay, so by Friday the 24th, while I'm out of town, you'll have all your content done and then I will send you the library of stuff here shortly so that your team knows how to structure their, their writings.

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, perfect.

Chris LaFay: Does that sound good?

Keith Berelowitz: Yeah, sounds perfect.

Chris LaFay: Lovely. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

Keith Berelowitz: Chris, thank you. That's great.

Chris LaFay: Productive today.

Keith Berelowitz: Thanks a lot. Have a good day.

Chris LaFay: Bye.

Keith Berelowitz: Bye.