Gavin Taylor - F2F

Chris LaFay: Good morning.

Gavin Taylor: I to cancel. You like that again?

Chris LaFay: Oh, no, you're. You're fine. I. I do not have a lack of work to do. So it's not like I sat here twiddling my thumb doing nothing. Oh my gosh. What am I going to do with my life now?

Gavin Taylor: So those like that roller coaster of just the workload has hit so hard recently. Like some days I'm like sitting here like, oh, I'm actually caught up. And the next day it's not even close.

Chris LaFay: The joys. It's a wonderful thing. Right. Today is one of those.

Gavin Taylor: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: Where I actually feel caught up. Mainly because I delivered a couple things a couple days ago. And those things are out of my mental load at the moment. But they will come back in a couple of weeks, which is fine. But such is life. Did you solve your Facebook conundrums?

Gavin Taylor: People be deleting stuff enough. This shouldn't be this guy. Old, old client of ours deleted his Facebook profile and he profile. Yep. Which causes every issue you could think of. So I'm just gonna last to Jeffrey and I might hate send this to Facebook and I'm gonna be honest with you. It's gonna be a coin flip. It's honestly a 5050 shot that they restore or not.

Chris LaFay: Oh, my. Dude. Dude.

Gavin Taylor: Yep.

Chris LaFay: That sucks.

Gavin Taylor: Most people don't understand how like the actual Facebook business manager works. So they don't understand, like if you delete your profile, you're really. Speaking of.

Chris LaFay: Sorry. Somebody sent me a quick slack message. I needed to like, take sentences too. I would die on the inside. Like, I, I. We had a client one time who their domain name was purchased by another agency, and that agency would not give them back their domain name, so they had to start over. Now granted, it's a small mom and pop business. They it was more emotional from like, I want to own my stuff standpoint than did it really actually matter? It probably didn't at the end of the day. But not owning your stuff and then not realizing how your stuff is connected together.

Gavin Taylor: Before I had integrity, I should say, in this space, I would go out and look for smaller businesses. I'd buy everything online, like the domains, like the variations of the domains, everything. And then I'll go to them like, hey, I have all your stuff. I'll give it to you for five grand. And five grand is that magic number because for them to go after me for a trademark or anything, it's gonna cost them 10,000.

Chris LaFay: Oh.

Gavin Taylor: It was kind of a lesson for them. It's like you have to have it because I can take all of your SEO value online and push it to my stuff. That's exactly what I would do. If they positive fight over it. I go and put up 301re drugs to the competitors.

Chris LaFay: Oh my gosh, dude. Holy crap. That's freaking nuts.

Gavin Taylor: I made hundreds of thousands of dollars doing that. Then one day I just felt, I felt so slimy doing it. I was like, okay, I'm done with this.

Chris LaFay: You made hundreds with an S. I'm.

Gavin Taylor: Talking like I would sell probably 5 to 5 to 10 of these a month for a while.

Chris LaFay: Holy crap. Oh my gosh.

Gavin Taylor: It was insane. But again, let's keep in mind this is eight years ago. Eight, nine years ago.

Chris LaFay: That's more money back then.

Gavin Taylor: Like yeah, it was. But no, I made a lot of money doing it,.

Chris LaFay: Dude.

Gavin Taylor: That came off of me losing a whole bunch of money for like just buying a whole bunch of domains and paying thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars a month just in keeping them.

Chris LaFay: Yeah. And the hope of selling one for a profit later.

Gavin Taylor: I still have probably 300, 400 domains. Some of them I can't justify leaving them. Like I said, they're on them. I'm like, this is such a good domain. Maybe one day I'm gonna do something with it. And then I just never do.

Chris LaFay: I am. The biggest domain name that I purchased was my own, which was classiccity.com because my domain name was classiccity consulting.com and that did not fit on a business card very well. And I found that classiccity.com was available for the great tune of $3,000. And at that point I had a non partner business partner. This was back when I was basically doing freelance stuff. I had a guy that just, he did video work and he was like, I can create Classic City Productions and I can run the video arm and you run the web arm. And I'm like, that sounds dope. We should do that. And so at that, the sliver of time lasted about six months. In that six months, he found classic city.com and he's like, I'll split it with you. And I was like, I can pay 1500, that sounds fine. And we bought classiccity.com and then 12 months later the dude went to jail and I've never talked to him since. So I got my, my main domain name for fifteen hundred dollars with a partner. So here we are.

Gavin Taylor: Every time I've tried to like do partnership in this industry, it's turned out God awful.

Chris LaFay: It's not worth it. It's not. No, it's. There are. I have seen some success stories. They happen. They absolutely do. I've seen it happen. Just the likelihood of it happening is slim. And honestly, what you're really not. I'm making assumptions in general. What most people are not looking for is an equity partner. Even though that's what they feel like they're looking for, they're really looking for a consistent sounding board who's in it with them and doesn't mind making some money. And you can get that level of commitment from a contractor partner who is also doing their own entrepreneurial stuff as well too.

Gavin Taylor: I had a partner in a past agency, actually two of them. One was just like sales. So one guy was kind of our sales guy. I was a marketing guy. Another guy was the CEO. It collapses around money every single time because the CEO guy was pushing the sales guy. He's like, hey, we gotta push this, this, this to this, like doing these bogus claims and just all this stuff just try to get the next dollar. So anyways, okay, let's talk about your ads for a second. Well, not your ads, but yeah, for your clients. So have you ever offered ads to your clients before?

Chris LaFay: No, let me back up. I have. It's been a while. Just because I have one person that does it on my crew. But he is also very busy in general. And so he's my lead dev. He's one of those Jack of all trades kind of people.

Gavin Taylor: Yep.

Chris LaFay: He runs his own business. He does ads for himself. It's all like, it's all good. It's not that he's bad at them, he just, just doesn't have as much time for it as he used to.

Gavin Taylor: Okay, have you put any thought on how you would want to structure like white label versus referral versus whatever?

Chris LaFay: I typically do. So what I, what I've done in the past is I do one of, one of two things. If somebody needs some like quick hit help that they honestly just need, like for lack of better terminology, a few hours of a smart person's time to be like, yeah, you're directionally correct. We'll do a meeting, we'll look at some stuff, we'll put a couple of tweaks in and we'll take you from 30% to 50% sort of thing that I, that I agree. I typically, I don't really ever white label anything. I typically gray label anything like that to where it's like, you're gonna go talk to Bob and I got you, I got, we're covering all this, this is what it will cost. But go talk to Bob. And then typically if there's anything longer term that comes from that, I'm just like, there you go, God bless, go talk to Bob. Have fun. I covered this one. Not. When I say covered, I don't mean I offered it to them for free. They paid for it, but I made their life easier by just wrapping it into. You know, we use five hours of our retainer this month for this. That's the kind of stuff that, that's the kind of structure that I do.

Gavin Taylor: Okay. Okay, perfect. So I've done that quite. It's funny that you developers work the same way. Every developer I work like that, same thing. Okay, so what I've done most recently with another developer is he will go out and line it up, I'll do my clothes, my sale, do whatever. And then my whole gig about to make sure that he continues making money on it is I gave him the option of, hey, I can give you like a split, like I pay my sales guys X amount. I'll give you that each month. Or I will just push like, hey, we can add this to your development and you get more development hours. If that's like the direction you want to go with that. And then whenever we do need like an update with development, it will always go back to you. Yeah, it would never be anyone else.

Chris LaFay: We typically when, when we, when we do, when there's people that want that type of work and this isn't, this is not a, this doesn't happen super often. But typically what? Typically the way that it, we have it is that the folks that want. Sorry, I've sorted like five sentences. I apologize. Typically the folks that want ads help typically are folks that we have on retainer already. Okay. And so we're already doing their dev work or design work or insert any number of things in there and this is just an add on to whatever they're currently doing. And so I hear, I hear what you're saying. Most of the time that's not even like a problem slash consideration.

Gavin Taylor: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: So.

Gavin Taylor: Okay, perfect. Now the next thing just to make sure that if you do refer any business over, there's like a clear set expectations. I don't work with new people in the industry at all. In any industry. Right. So you, you probably ran into them is, hey, I just started this business, I'm gonna like go all out. I'm gonna invest on a new website, I'm gonna invest in ads, I'm gonna invest in this. But they don't Have a proven model underneath them and expect, oh hey, I'm gonna go through an agency, thousands of dollars a month and I'm gonna become a millionaire. I strongly do not work with them. So just heads up on that. In an ideal world, unless they've been in business at least a handful of years, unless they've seen those ups and downs, unless they are. If it's like a solopreneur at the 100,200 thousand dollar range, if they're an actual business over the seven seven figure range, that's kind of my limit because I don't want to put someone in a bind by paying me.

Chris LaFay: And the ads, it's like the, what do you call. It's like the frick. Where you. The problem with working with founder led businesses is just the, the simple fact of you're basically just taking money out of their. Their pocketbook.

Gavin Taylor: Exactly.

Chris LaFay: At the end of the day, like it's your. I actually, I love founder led businesses. Like they're actually my favorite ones to work with. The downside with them though is just the fact that they. It's hard, it's hard to get, it's not hard to get paid. But it feels asking for more money is always a hard thing because you're taking money out of their pocketbook. And that sucks.

Gavin Taylor: Absolutely. And that's. That sucks. And I love founder led businesses and everything like that, but most of the time in the marketing agency world you're setting up them. Them to fail. Right. So I usually like have a. So my fee and this is just like in feed not including everything is $1500 a month or 10 of ad spend, whichever is greater. So up to 15, what is it, $15,000. They are only paying $1500 a month. That makes sense.

Chris LaFay: Yeah, that seems very reasonable.

Gavin Taylor: And I do everything month to month, so I don't lock anyone in. I do set the expectation of hey, we need to give a quarter at very minimum. But that.

Chris LaFay: Yeah, yeah, that's it. Which is what I. That's basically my whole thing too is I do. My agreements are all annual technically because I hate doing paperwork. But everything, everything is, I mean everything's cancelable pretty much immediately if you wanted it to be. So I feel that we're a lot wor.

Gavin Taylor: And then I pay my sales guys really, really good. And then in this case you as a referral, really really good. So that way it makes sense for you to continue doing it. So I split a third of it. So 500 goes right to you.

Chris LaFay: I got you. I. It doesn't matter. That doesn't matter as much to me. I don't do a ton of referral agreements, mainly because I don't. Mainly because most of the people that I work with actually let me back up. I don't normally do referral agreements because most of the people I work with don't touch web at all. And so they typically send over a lot of stuff to me. And a lot of them don't expect referral, don't expect commission payments either. So that does not matter.

Gavin Taylor: Okay.

Chris LaFay: One iota, as long as you do a good job.

Gavin Taylor: Yep.

Chris LaFay: That's pretty much all I care about.

Gavin Taylor: Perfect.

Chris LaFay: You say thank you. That's all I need. Literally.

Gavin Taylor: Yeah.

Chris LaFay: People, I'm not a. I'm not one about. I do not express overabundance of gratitude very well. It's not my. Not my personality. I am a handshake, look you in the eye, say thank you, pat you on the back. And that's all I do. And that's. I realize that I have to. I tell people that more often now because that's just my style. I'm not overly gushy with gratitude. I should be. But I'm just.

Gavin Taylor: I mean, today's. Everyone's over gushing about everything and they're just like, you're not wrong. I just want to go. How are you doing?

Chris LaFay: Thanks.

Gavin Taylor: Have a big day.

Chris LaFay: Yes.

Gavin Taylor: It's funny, I'm being more and more socially awkward the older I get.

Chris LaFay: It's like you get more comfortable in your own skin or something like that.

Gavin Taylor: Yep. Awesome. Well, I mean, do you have any questions for me about any of that?

Chris LaFay: I don't. Only really, because this stuff doesn't come up super often, but when it does, it's important. And so knowing what I have at my disposal, that's the. That's kind of the key. And I. I understand this world like, I'm not in it, but I understand. So it's not. It's not complex. Meaning if I like you, you do a good job, I'm good. I don't really care. I don't say I don't care in a apathetic way. I mean, I totally get it.

Gavin Taylor: You have other things to worry about. Yep.

Chris LaFay: Yeah. Yeah.

Gavin Taylor: Perfect.

Chris LaFay: I do. We have 10 minutes. I did want to show you. I definitely went switching gears.

Gavin Taylor: Yep. I was already thinking in my head, so.

Chris LaFay: The local jungle thing, I definitely went really far to the side this past week, and I wanted to show you something that I think will help you. And I don't think you will like it. But that's okay because I had fun doing it and I think it might open up some new ideas for you. Okay, so that's all I'm gonna say with that. I'm gonna go ahead and share my screen.

Gavin Taylor: I do have an update about all that too.

Chris LaFay: So that's all. That's all. Fine. Window. I don't want to switch tabs every time. Let's see if my browser crashes. I've not restarted my computer today, so we'll see if it crashes. When I. If it does, I'll come right back.

Gavin Taylor: Yes.

Chris LaFay: Hot dang. Didn't. Okay, so what I was thinking about was your, like, onboarding process on stuff. You have your Google Doc. My thinking was, how could you do this on a lot more of an organized way? And so I did some updates to it. It's in a markdown file. I will edit that and toss it in your Google Doc as a separate tab so you can review it and do whatever changes you want to it. But I was like, what if you actually. If there was a place where all of your stuff lived so that everybody had access to it from the browser, basically, and everything was in an organized, consolidated way. This is not an app. This is just a. This is a mockup, if you will. So having all of your customers with their intake forms with required fields to show you what's complete, what's not complete. Claude would have access to all of this. And then you could then run through the existing site map from like a crazy frog export versus here's the laundry list of potential pages that you might need, because maybe this one does, you know, European cars or BMWs, and you need to have different pages for those. It'll basically mash up the existing sitemap that's live right now with your SEO pages that the client probably doesn't have yet. And then allow you to go through and be like, need this one, don't need this one, need this one, don't need this one. This then outputs and then you could then build that queue to actually then have it go through and create that content for you that uses your script that you wrote. And then you would then be able to view as these all get generated what is happening. So you could have it only do a couple. You could have it do one. One section at a time, all of it at one time. But then you could then view what that HTML looks like for editing. So this is different. This is very different. I am 100 understanding of that. But I wanted to show you a.

Gavin Taylor: Con not too much. This is actually kind of a rabbit hole. I'm going down right now. Here is. We'll kind of go down the path on different routes. So here's an update I got for you. We are 90 going to Astro, but that's over the next six months. I talked with Craig and there is a chance that we don't. I don't know where that came from, but there is a chance we don't. So the Penguin 2 site we were working on is a template. I got the green light. I'm going to optimize that site now. That's going to be our template. I'm going to go ball to the wall. I'm going to optimize it, get it where we need it to go. I already have my senior developer working on it. However, we are making huge changes. They were working together for like a month to put together like, hey, here's how everything needs to be structured for our page speed and everything on WordPress.

Chris LaFay: Like you have me as your developer and then Craig had an other like site speed developer that he was.

Gavin Taylor: So yeah, I have you as a consultant. Develop a developer consultant. I have actually, funny enough, he's on upwork. He's worked with Craig for years at this point. His name's LRO. He's. He's our senior developer. And then we have E2M which is all just like going to be fire developers. So I honestly, at this point I'm just waiting for an opportunity to switch them out. I know that's going to be a pain in the ass. Don't do it right now.

Chris LaFay: Yeah.

Gavin Taylor: So love the senior developer. Well, he's been doing his work. When Craig come up with the page speed stuff, figure out everything out why our WordPress feeds have been a freaking roller coaster on an hourly basis. Not even a daily basis. On an hourly basis. In the morning it will be like a 90 whatever. In the afternoon it will drop down to like 70 and in the extremes it'll drop down to 40. And that doesn't even make sense why it would do that.

Chris LaFay: And I think your hosting account has a lot to. My opinion is y' all are on siteground. I think a lot has to do with your hosting.

Gavin Taylor: So we were looking at switching that. It's actually the plugins and the settings and the conflicts. A lot of it had to do with wp. What is it? WP Rocket?

Chris LaFay: Yeah, the. The caching. The caching, yeah.

Gavin Taylor: Had a lot to do with caching. How it's cached and then overlap with Cloudflare. So that.

Chris LaFay: Okay, interesting. That's not my area.

Gavin Taylor: Yeah, I'm not, I'm not.

Chris LaFay: That sounds really odd to me.

Gavin Taylor: It has to do with CDNs that. To do with all that. I don't know, they worked on it either way. Long story short, I'm gonna optimize this site exactly how we want. I'm probably going to re engage you sooner rather than later to finish out the local jungle plugin because I have a vision on how I'm going to do it with Astro. And it's all through Claude. Which brings me to this. It's essentially this. Now I'm going to pre build all the landing page, all the PPC landing pages. So because I know that they're all going to use Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Land Rover, whatever, Porsche. Right. So I'm going to pre build those landing pages, have everything in there. I know what service pages that we'll need and then I'll spin up the sites like that. But how it's working with Astro is what I'm going to be able to do is once I optimize the site, I'm going to take those site files, throw it into Claude. Claude, spit out the simplified coding or whatever it is that does. It's JavaScript, CSS, very basic static code. And then it's going to spin up a new site in Astro. Now I'm going to have a template in Astro as well to do the same thing. And then I found a way that with Google Sheets I will have basically an ACF form, if you will, and a button on Google Sheets. So I fill it out, press a button, it spins up, the program goes to Claude, Claude writes, it goes to Aztro. Boom, there's a new site, takes 15 minutes. So exactly what you were talking about in the beginning. And then the end goal is to have an interface just like this instead of Google Sheets that spins up the code, that pushes it to Astra.

Chris LaFay: Yep.

Gavin Taylor: Which is what I'm saying. Same path, two different webs. I just need to finish out the template first.

Chris LaFay: Do you know how to code those templates? Well, so that they are using consistent parts and pieces and nothing is hard coded.

Gavin Taylor: Yep, that's going to be the other developer.

Chris LaFay: Okay. Because what my. I don't know exactly how Astro works, but my recommendation would be that you have a folder of what I'm going to call templates. And when I say templates, I'm thinking more along the lines of global templates, meaning this is your nav bar, this is your footer, these are the things that don't. The structure of them doesn't really change and they're used globally across every page. So if you make, if you do make a change in it, it then applies it to all pages. I would then have another section, another folder called Patterns. And don't, don't lean too hard into these names where you have your two column layout, a three column layout, a image grid layout. In all of the paddings, the margins, the gap sizes, the. There should be three different font sizes, small, medium, and large. All of your headings are exactly the same.

Gavin Taylor: So the nodes on our last calls that you went over all this. I have kind of compiled. Claude has all of that.

Chris LaFay: Okay.

Gavin Taylor: I. Because Claude was saying the exact same thing after I loaded all the notes I had with you. Yeah, 100 agreed with you. Okay, so that's exactly what we're gonna do. Now. The only difference is on the WordPress side, we're gonna put. I don't remember if it was a theme or the. I think it was the theme. We put as much as we can in the theme and then the theme.

Chris LaFay: Are you talking about the Astro version or you talking about the WordPress?

Gavin Taylor: I'm talking about the WordPress version. It's either the theme or the child theme. I don't know the terminology. One of the two. So that way it's. It's something that you've told me before. It's basically the structure of the site. Right. And then once we go and edit the site, it's just very minor, like aesthetics and things like that and content. Right. So this, I think you are just four months ahead of schedule with. We just didn't catch up to this first.

Chris LaFay: When. Okay, so my question is, what is, what is causing you to not do something like this? Now, rather, in skipping past the Google Sheet phase entirely,.

Gavin Taylor: It makes sense for me in my head to edit a Google Sheet where I can go and edit it and everything to optimize it before we put it into this, then build this out and then go back through and keep editing this. Where I have to have you or developer edit this and I can't. That's really the only reason to be honest with you.

Chris LaFay: Gotcha. Okay, that makes sense. What, what my thought is, the way that this would work is inside of this application. I'm thinking, I'm not thinking about WordPress. I'm nothing about Astro. Inside this application you would have all of basically every single input. So obviously we have all like the, the text and stuff here. Like with address, ownership, Type like all this is typed out and whatnot. There would also be fields for like logo uploads, primary colors, CTA colors, the theming of it all as well too would all live in here too.

Gavin Taylor: Basically the fulfillment launch packet 100.

Chris LaFay: Yeah, exactly. Would all live in here. There would actually probably be. Rather than right now the client view is just one tab. There would actually probably be just multiple tabs on here where you have like identity information, page information, site map, look and feel, etc and also in this app at a global level would have access to the, the shareable template parts, headers, footers, etc. The individual building blocks that could then get manipulated with content and then also page layouts that are basically just a conglomeration of blocks where it's like header hero 1, 2 column, 3 column coupons, etc. Etc.

Gavin Taylor: Listen, would you be able to sync this with ClickUp?

Chris LaFay: Send what to click I sync it with ClickUp. Oh, sync it with ClickUp.

Gavin Taylor: So for example, and the reason I asked that is ClickUp is our source of truth. Yeah, source of truth right now. This would be awesome. And what I've been finding is we have our. It's called a master sheet. I've been trying to get them out of freaking. There's Google sheets. I love Google sheets to a point. Until we have a different sheet for a million different things and it drives me nuts. So we have a master sheet as a whole bunch of tabs for each of the clients which this is essentially that and it's going to go over. Okay, here's the onboarding questions. Here is the vetting questions. Like it's, it's crazy to think about because me personally, I'm like, okay, ideal client, $10,000 or more a month. We've been in business five years or longer, boom, done. I can work with you. For a local jungle, it's so much more than that. So like on our master sheet we have this long ass vetting process. We have very long onboarding process. But I figure if we could actually make that into this, it would solve a lot of our problems.

Chris LaFay: Before.

Gavin Taylor: Let me take a look. Master clients. Not sure if this is the updated one. Yeah, this isn't updated. This is just like a one that we're working on. But it's very, very, very close post. I just sent it to you. I think we have like coupons and stuff on the new one.

Chris LaFay: Hold this. This drives me nuts. Google is starting to put things in different tabs on this left side. So it's like you just got to share and it comes in through chat. I'm like, no, I don't.

Gavin Taylor: I hate that. I hate that they. We did the icons too. I absolutely cannot stand the new icons.

Chris LaFay: Huh? Yes. Okay, so.

Gavin Taylor: Okay, so vetting sheet, sales sheet, onboarding sheet. This is everything that happens before technical onboarding.

Chris LaFay: Yeah.

Gavin Taylor: Okay, so it's, it's not like a whole bunch. It could. I think it could be redone a little bit. And then we're adding our strategy stuff to it.

Chris LaFay: So.

Gavin Taylor: This isn't the final copy of it. I know Dan has the final copy, but I'm thinking if each of the clients we had all this in that application you just built, that would make life incredibly easy because it would all be under one now. The problem is. No, that's not a problem. That would honestly be amazing. And I want to talk to Craig. He's out today, but I want to talk to him about that. Can you have a, like, preview link.

Chris LaFay: To that right now? I don't, but let me. I can, I can make it pretty previewable. Yeah, sorry, that was a hard word to say. I can make it previewable. It's just basically going to be three URLs, because nothing is dynamic at all. So you would have three URLs. One is just Dashboard HTML, one is Client HTML, and another is Sitemap HTML. And so I can send those over, but I will. Before I send it, I have a little bit of time today. I will take the. I will take this and, and have it process through this as well. Too.

Gavin Taylor: Now my question to you is there are also solutions already out there that's already built. Like this kind of. Not the, not the fact that it's sending. Never mind. It's different because it's sending it to like, build those pages. Huh. Or that content.

Chris LaFay: This is, this is very. So I've looked into, like, project management systems, content, like collecting of content from clients and stuff like that. I've looked into a lot of these. Those systems before. I'm not saying that I haven't seen. There's something out there that I haven't seen that's very much possible. I don't think there's anything out there that does this.

Gavin Taylor: I think I, I agree. I think it's unique, but in my head, like, the first things I think of is like, Base Camp, which is client communication, which I. It is what it is. I think it's just color scheme.

Chris LaFay: I based the layout off of Base Camp, so I, I love. We. We don't use Base Camp, but I really like the owners of Base Camp and I like their business ethos. I can't speak to them as humans, but I really like their business ethos and I, I follow them and do I follow a lot of their stuff.

Gavin Taylor: It's funny that you say that. Then it's. I'm glad I picked that up.

Chris LaFay: Yep. Actually that when I built it, I was, I. I submitted screenshots to Claude and was like, look at Base Camp's ui. It. They do a lot of stuff really well here. It's not. And because they don't follow standard UX patterns for software there, it's very different. It's very card oriented. It's very. They have a very tangible, tactile feel to a lot of what they do. And I like that. And it's very different because Click up looks the same as Asana, looks the same as. Right. Like, obviously they all look a little different. They have small different features, but at the end of the day it's a to do list with sections and then a project can have multiple of those done. They're all the same. So.

Gavin Taylor: This also makes it easier jumping from one to another.

Chris LaFay: It's like, oh, hey, we want to switch from Asana to ClickUp. Great. Whoa. Like, don't get me wrong, there are minor features between all of them that are different. They have different ui, they, they feel different, which is why people prefer X versus Y. They have some.

Gavin Taylor: Well, they all do the same thing.

Chris LaFay: That was the same freaking thing.

Gavin Taylor: I like Monday the best, but I hate how they have it separated into different things.

Chris LaFay: Monday's too big. Monday is not like somebody is using. Somebody I know is using their, like, CRM functionality. And they're like, it doesn't connect with my. I forgot what the thing that they complained about, but it was like something basic. Like it doesn't connect with my email. And I'm like. Because it's a project management system. Not. They're calling themselves like a business operations platform. And I'm like, that's not.

Gavin Taylor: If they put all this stuff into one, it would like all the functionality into one. It would work so much better. Yeah. Now that the AI platform.

Chris LaFay: What. What does this mean? What? Tell me what this means. Or people and agents drive results together on a workplace platform. What is a work platform? I don't know.

Gavin Taylor: They're trying to encompass that all in.

Chris LaFay: One, which is true. I get that. But it's.

Gavin Taylor: And this is what I hate the service. The. Oh, I hate that.

Chris LaFay: Wait, they're getting into Vibe coding. What?

Gavin Taylor: You don't this is another high level thing. They're just throwing out the wall. That's why I fell off of High Level. I mean the, that the automation. The site's pretty damn cool.

Chris LaFay: But yeah, absolutely. Oh my gosh.

Gavin Taylor: Oh yeah. That's the problem I have with High Level. Because High Level was a great CRM, a phenomenal CRM. And then they started adding too much to it.

Chris LaFay: Business Operating Platform Form. No, you're not. Trello Capture organizing. Like this is actually better. Like Trello little card dragging project. Like one of the OG project management systems. Like this is actually better because Trello's not competing with the Mondays and the asanas and all that jazz. They are like, we do kanban, we do cards. And it's like moving a whiteboard from, you know, one thing to one thing to one thing.

Gavin Taylor: This. See, I like Old School Monday. I really like Old School Monday for a while.

Chris LaFay: Yep.

Gavin Taylor: I like ClickUp. However, ClickUp over complicates just to over complicate it. So there's that. But yeah, so is another good one.

Chris LaFay: Let me do, Let me do this. Let me. I have some time right now. Let me. I want to work on this, this faux app right now. I have a couple of ideas and I want to hop on them now while I'm thinking about. Okay, let me go ahead and do that. And.

Gavin Taylor: Lj write them down before you.

Chris LaFay: It's a new. It's a different process every day. Some days I'm like, you know what? I need an online task management. Other days I'm like, I need to handwrite. I. I don't have a system. I don't, I don't.

Gavin Taylor: My, my notepad. So my computer's gotten ridiculous. I have both monitors covered. If I open up my sticky notes.

Chris LaFay: Because that's a great way to keep track of things and make sure that you know exactly what the priorities are, which is have 25 sticky notes all over the place. I'm. I'm saying the same thing to myself because I have an online task list and a paper one as well too, and an inbox. And I'm like. And I'm trying to get Claude to help me with my TO dos. Maybe like if I just chat with Claude, maybe that'll actually, if I, if Claude builds me like a little to do list thing, maybe that will help me. Or I just don't like doing crap and I only like doing what sounds exciting in the moment. Maybe that's my problem.

Gavin Taylor: That's called adhd.

Chris LaFay: Oh my gosh.

Gavin Taylor: Awesome. I'll let you go. Let me know if anything comes up where you need help with the ads and we'll go from there. And yeah, I. I feel really good about Local Jungle right now because we did bring on a new client. We already almost launched them within two weeks. So.

Chris LaFay: Did you use some of the new stuff that I built,.

Gavin Taylor: Yes or no? No, because the fact that we are reusing a big portion of the. The site. Let me show you this really quick. I know, I know. I told you. We know, but one sec. Want to steal a screenshot for a minute?

Chris LaFay: Oh, yeah, hold on, hold on.

Gavin Taylor: I got you.

Chris LaFay: Let me kill this. Killed.

Gavin Taylor: So we rebuilt this completely.

Chris LaFay: Oh, this one. I remember. Yeah, you talked about this a week or so ago.

Gavin Taylor: Yeah. And we're already towards the finish line. We have the PPC pages up. The one thing we need to do is pictures still. But yeah, just about that.

Chris LaFay: That was good. That was really freaking good, actually. I know you copied the design from the existing site too. So the fact.

Gavin Taylor: Which is funny because this is a design that I copied from us. So we actually have this template and we are actually using this template. They have made some modifications so that I actually really like. It's just little like design elements to it, like the Parallax goal here, whatever. I do like the testimonials, but this is all hard coded and it's not brought in. But yeah, that's. That's it. So nice. We got this whole process under two weeks now, which is phenomenal. If we had to rebuild this whole site, I don't think we would have been. But I mean, it is what it is. It's getting close.

Chris LaFay: Very nice, man. I like it. That's dope.

Gavin Taylor: Yep. Awesome. Well, yeah, we'll. We'll chat later. Let me know if you need anything.

Chris LaFay: Sounds like a plan, sir. I'll catch you later, man.

Gavin Taylor: Bye.

Chris LaFay: Bye.